Funnily enough, I originally wanted to put in something along the lines of this into my last post's ending; "Chances are now that I've refuted most if not all of your points, you'll have to resort to just calling me dumb being the argumentative know-it-all you've painted yourself as. Of course now that I've pointed this out you have to formulate an entirely new response."

Then I thought, "Nah, I'll do it afterwords". See, this way you'll probably end up calling me dumb again out of desperation thinking "Maybe if I do it enough times he'll realize I'm right". Or you won't reply at all. But see I still win because I just predicted that you won't reply so you have to reply but the only type of reply you can give is a superficial insult since I pointed out a lot of flaws in your points. Horhorhor you fell into my clever trap of words. Admit defeat and I will spare you from my mighty e-penor.

(Oh and if you haven't guessed most of what I said above was me just mocking you in sheer irony but I'm sure you took it seriously up until now considering your earlier response to satire)



Yes, but in a big city with four or five gun stores, there's going to be at the very least one or the other. They aren't rare antiques like a Derringer or something for fudge sake. Regardless, earlier I said that realistically/seriously I would probably look for no more than a handgun and hole up in a department store.



EDIT: Oh and as Hyperkultra said we should probably get back on topic since it's not about the plan so much as effective ways of killing zombies.

How effective do you guys think fire (eg molotov cocktails) is as a weapon against zombies? If we're still under the assumption that zombies can't feel pain, it wouldn't really deter them from attacking you. While they're on fire. Flaming zombie attacks :< I think eventually the fire would probably get put out after burning through their clothes and maybe hair/skin, if it wasn't under the influence of accelerants etc, with no fuel to burn.

Well in suburban Australia you're not going to easily find guns either way, rare or common.
(Which is where I live by the way, so I'll have to make to with some knives tied to a long pole)

Well apparently it is since the retarded shambling type originated from George A. Romero's work.

The "want to eat brains in a feeble attempt to replace their own retarded brains with non retarded ones" originated from Return of the living dead actually, in that the zombies were almost impossible to kill; you would have to destroy the body beyond function. Burning them would just make their trixion gas which re-animated them rain back down as precipitation. Zombifying the deceased that are affected.



I have been on this forum damn well longer than you and that other guy combined have been. Remember LE0Nteh1337? Probably not since he joined in 2007 and left around late 2008. I recently rejoined however. I damn well have all rights to point you and everyone else on their ♥♥♥♥, especially since I clearly know more than they do and have the experience to back it up with.



You don't seem to understand now do you? They're so rare that it doesn't matter how many gunstores there are. They're so rare that finding one is virtually impossible. The odds being comparable to finding a needle in a haystack.

Oh and you can disable censorship by the way.

Simmer down, the both of you. You are arguing about fictional beings, of which there are too many interpretations to decide upon a standard by default. Figure out which interpretation you will be using before you go all out and argue about it at the very least. Venusian radiation, swamp gas, viruses... Whatever.

@Loen: They changed the filter, so now it's all hearts. It made me sad

A good amount of SPAS-12 and SPAS-15 shotguns flowed into the US in the 70s and 80s for police force (not only for combat but also because the SPAS-12 can use beanbag and teargas rounds) and many civilians bought them too until firearm laws outlawed importation of SPAS models since they were classified as "military weapons" but then civilian variants came out and even the old military variants weren't prevented from being sold and shipped inside US borders. 'kk?

Regardless, that's irrelevant to current discussion. This is about the effectiveness of weapons against zombies, not their rarity and how realistic or unrealistic it would be to assume you could acquire them.



I intentionally put in fudge. If I had wanted to say fuck, I would've.

Surely it could be on topic, if it is how effective it is in a zombie apocolypse? Killing vs availability of weapon and ammo?

And, what melee weapons could be considered effective?
Here in the UK I have no firearms.

Effectiveness of weapons on zombies? Well, look at it this way. I assume you all have testicles. Now say you got kicked in them. Painful, right? Now, if you couldn't feel pain, would it bother you? Yes. No matter if you feel the pain or not, you are physically moved in a slight upwards/backwards direction, and your balance is thrown around for a second or two. Now, if someone pokes a hole in you with a small lead lump from a hundred meters away, will that hurt? Hell yeah. If pain is not felt, will it harm you? Yes. While it may not throw your balance around as much (assuming you aren't armored), it will go through you and damage tissue and stuff. No pain, lots of damage. Damaged muscles doesn't work well. That makes it harder to move. There's other stuff than muscles that can be damaged. Heart and brain are like the off-switches of the body. Spine is permanent stand-by button.

Bullets will harm shawambees as much as they'll harm hooomeeen, they just won't hurt them.

I wouldn't go for melee. That's basically only based on causing pain to immobilize so you can cause harm. They don't feel the pain. You can't get harming blow in.

mark 19 AGL
m2 browning
fifteen thousand zombies

final destination

Most of them have been bought up by collectors, making them relatively uncommon today. The HK-416 is pretty much unheard of within the US other then maybe a handful of upper receivers including the firing pin, bolt, carrier, piston, barrel, gas block. I'm not to sure if it uses a proprietary buffer tube and recoil spring however. Other then those two questionable parts the only compatible USGI M16 pattern rifle parts are the lower receiver and fire control group.

Those have also been bought up by collectors however, the median price being comparable to that of a new car. As I said previously, finding one would be like finding a needle in a haystack unless you have the questionable uncanny ability to find extremely obscure stuff with ease. Even if you did find one, what would you do if something broke inside of it? you would be royally screwed over. It just isn't worth it compared to any other weapon that's just as effective.

Don't give me the whole "M16 JAMS HK STRONG" argument either. Any good M16/AR-15 pattern rifle with even a normal amount of lubrication can run through thousands of rounds before needing to be cleaned and re-lubed.

in a zombie apocalypse your motivation to keep your gun clean is rather immediate also

Weeellll, fleshy parts do burn a bit, but for a sec, let's assume the zombies are the actually dead kind that decay. The intestinal bacteria would leave the intestine, and start making gasses, including methane, which we all know is burnable from lighting farts on fire. So. We have a zombie that is slowly filling up with flammable gasses, and we are asking if molotovs will do some damage. The zombie will most likely explode throwing napalm-y bile and burning zombie parts everywhere, which will spread the fire to more zombies, and kill/seriously maimthe zombie in question.

Tl;dr: FIRE MAKES ZOMBIES EXPLODE.

I reject your logical reasoning. Excuse me while I go search for survivors in my inflatable raft.



15,000 zombies? That's a lot of .50 bullets there :V



Very few. I imagine you would have to do some serious internal damage eg bust a few organs or maybe fracture the zombie's spine to do any real damage if you were using a blunt weapon. Meanwhile, anything that could decapitate a zombie would be useful, I suppose, but the problem is distance. You have to get up close to a zombie to do damage with a melee weapon.

Effective weapons... a shovel would be a good choice. It has a flat, wide side that can do some serious damage if you were to use it as a 'power hammer' and smack the zombie in the head in an up-to-down motion, possibly break the zombie's neck. The edges, if sharp, could stab through a zombie or decapitate it.

Another good choice would be an ax, but it would have to be a very sharp one. I don't think hacking at the body would do any good- you probably only have time for a hit or two at that distance, and the blade of an axe is typically not big or sharp enough to cut through a zombie's body and be immediately fatal, so you'd want to hack at the neck in a horizontal motion.

Also a good choice would be a baseball bat, preferably a metal one- a wooden one can splinter too easily and an aluminum one will dent easily, and the metal one is the heaviest of the all. It could maybe crush in the skull of a zombie and if all else fails, it would at least knock a zombie to the ground and give you a chance to get in a few easy blows that would probably have a fatal combined force.

BUT... a chainsaw is not a good choice, contrary to popular belief. Chainsaws won't slice through something like a knife through butter; you'd need to actively cut through a zombie, like you would using a regular saw. Additionally, many chainsaws are heavy, and the light ones have short blades that might not cut well and take a longer time to cut through. Chainsaws need gas or electricity to be operated, and they are very loud and will attract more zombies. Finally, they'd just be a pain to use compared to simpler weapons which only require a few good hits upside the head.

The main problem with melee weapons is consistency. Sometimes you might smack a zombie's head clear off with a bat if you, say, have the higher ground and are running forward and dealing with a skinny and small zombie. But in another encounter where you're frantically fending off a horde of zombies, each of your blows will be weaker and less disciplined and as you run out of energy they will weaken further. With a gun, the only possible variable in consistency is range; obviously the closer you are, the more powerful the shot is, but it doesn't make a huge difference.

alright, to set one thing straight, the zombies are not the shambling stupid kind. they are the ravenous, go through the quickest way possible, fence climbing, still have basic motor skills kind. think of them like dogs that are bipedal. i have no idea where you guys came up with the slow and stupid type when i was asked to clarify what kind, and I said L4D type, with slight mutatious variants. nothing RE4 mutated.

and please, if you must argue, please keep the insults to a minimum and the facts the main point. we aren't children, are we?

OK, i'm going to set the FACTS down for this thread.
-World is apocalyptic, The military isn't on orders to extinguish the threat, only to survive with minimal casualties and defend bases and let the zombies starve themselves out. They will not take you in.
-Zombies are fast, feral, and have most motor functions working with most of their former human strength intact.
-Weapons attainable are nothing exuberantly powerful, aka, nothing of a high military grade.
-the goal is surviving, and for the most part it is every man for themselves. there ARE cutthroats who will murder you for supplies.

if anything else should be cleared up, ask.

itt people with no experience with the military

in a world is ♥♥♥♥ situation they are not going to button up in bases and turn away everyone

the entire point of the military is to protect civilians. they might quarantine you, but the cynical view of the military people have had since the '60s is utterly wrong. they're not just instantly going to devolve into barbarous apes with the best firepower on the block. the whole idea behind a chain of command is that there is always order, even in a firefight and even in a nuclear holocaust.

Tom, who appointed you facts director, out of curiosity
just b/c it's your thread doesn't mean you get to dictate discussion. discussion will occur on whatever is being currently debated, and the majority of people are clearly basing discussion on "slow" zombies.