Agreed.
That's why many petitions are now ignored. At one point amnesty international was holding a competition where the school that returned the most signatures would get a concert. D'you think that the government, knowing this, will take the petition seriously? Also, half the signatures here are taking swings at the mods...

I think you need to base the reload times on real world examples. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AK-47 600rpm, 30 rounds as is masterfully copied by data in the in game AK-47, with a reload time of 1.5 seconds which he probably got from a recording off his camera when he went to the shooting range.

Do what you did with the Ronin rifle. Give us some pretty sound so we don't get bored. Seriously. I would be fine with two minute reloads if they had a bunch of kerchunks in 'em.

Long reload times are relative. I'm perfectly fine with taking my time and waiting to reload before continuing an infiltration mission, but there are others who aren't interested in the patience/tactical portions of the game. For those people, the reload times will be too long.

I agree with Thunder Toes in that if a long reload time bothers you so much, just change it in the .ini. If you're not willing to do it for 30+ weapons, it must not bother you so much after all.

Exactly! I don't see what the problem is. If you're* the kind of player who doesn't like to use strategy, then use guns with lower reload times. If you don't like strategy, why are you using the sniper rifle anyway?



*Not "you", AgentBaron.

Because it's ridiculously overpowered and available by default?

I have never understood the argument that because something is wrong you should just do something else, rather than fix the problem. Oh, well, your car's broken, but you can just borrow mine. But, what about my car?

So you feel that you want to play CC as a "strategy" game. I'm terribly sorry, but most "strategy" games involve more "strategy" than throwing units at the enemy units, which are being thrown at you, and then exploding into horrific piles of blood and guts. The only "strategy" element of the game is that you manage a resource. For god's sake, if Data wanted CC to be "strategic" why did he make everything have INFINITE AMMUNITION, JETPACK FUEL, ETC, ETC?

CC's meant to be an action game. Data's said that more than once. It happens to have a small gold digging mechanic, but that's more an exploitation of the particle destruction system than anything else; no serious players of the game actually ever DO dig for gold. I mean, for the last, what, five builds we've had broken gold dig mode, and no one's seriously complained. There are new official maps that barely/don't even HAVE gold in them.

And you shouldn't take this thread as proof that there ARE many people who agree with you. While the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence, the absence of evidence is pretty damning.

I WOULD LIKE TO REQUEST A REALLY OP GUN WITH BULLETS MADE OF TEST MATERIAL THAT CAN PWN ANYTHING AND COST NOTHING AND HAVE ZERO RELOAD TIME AND INFINITE CYCLIC RATE.

This is what you are asking for, Rawtoast, and I think the jury is out on shitty, overpowered guns.

I agree that this is a stupid point of view to take, but that's not what I did. I'm not saying "if you don't like the sniper rifle because it's ♥♥♥♥, don't use it", I'm saying "if you're not the type of person who has the patience to use sniper rifles in game, then don't use them". The difference is that I am not saying there is any flaw in the game itself. It's like buying a minicooper and complaining that it doesn't have enough trunk space. Well no ♥♥♥♥ - if you wanted trunk space, you should have bought a different car.



I never said that CC is a STRATEGY GAME. I said that it is strategic. By strategic, I mean that it is not some kind of arcade shooter. In an arcade shooter, an upgrade always makes your attack objectively more powerful. CC is different, I say more strategic, because upgrading, or buying something more expensive, will get you a gun that is not objectively better than a cheaper gun in every way. There are still balances. Spending more does not guarantee greater effectiveness, just a different sort. I'd call that a sort of strategy.


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It's an action game, yes - again, I never said CC is a strategy game, I said that it has strategic components. Rainbow 6 is an action game, but would you ever say that it doesn't involve strategy?

Cortex Command is not a blast-all, break-all, ♥♥♥♥ shooter.

I'm not, I was just throwing it out there.




This REALLY confused me. Could you go over that again? Where did I say anything about liking overpowered guns?

Reload times need to be shortened. Shortened meaning decrease by around 10%. With this said the one thing I do not want to happen is that one vanilla gun feels overpowered. Or that many guns in vanilla feel overpowered. *caugh*numgun*caugh*

If a gun must have a two minute reload time, why have it at all? I agree with OP that its just a cheap way of balancing. Same goes for balancing by making it cost 1,000,000oz - But thats another debate. Be creative in your balancing!

It's quite obviously known that there are a few different general factors that goes into balancing a gun: cost, reload time, and bullet strength.

Question is, how do you balance an overpowered gun when there are some that hate high cost and some that hate long reload time?

I would go so far as to say that overpowered guns are more or less "toys" in CC. They'll never quite be a serious game element and are more or less there for having fun slaughtering AI or for a really tough challenge when fighting against someone wielding them.

That said, I wonder the only real neutral way to balance an overpowered gun is not to. If people are only using them for fun and piddling around with AI and such, why bother with a high cost or long reload time?

Bear in mind this post applies more to obviously overpowered big 'splodey guns more than the vanilla guns.

Yes but the fact that virtually all (new) vanilla guns are ridiculously overpowered (compare the laser rifle to the ak-47 and tell me that's not true) is bringing special light to the fact. Either actors need a buff or weapons need a nerf, and this isn't the first time I've said this.

Guns arent overpowered when they can be used against you in the same situation. Sure, you may be able to get a one shot decap, but so can the AI. Sure, that one DStech uber laser thing may rape, but have you ever let the AI get ahold of it? Bad news.

Except the AI aren't that hard to dodge, and you can just let them miss their first few shots and hit them in the massive reload times.

Cortex command is not very articulate in terms of cover. yea, you can dig a trench, but cover is also very, VERY easily shot away, and unless we have portable walls, (maybeh we should?) reliable cover isnt very common. and for filling the map with trenches:

1. you tend to get killed wile making them

2. they get clogged really easily by gibs and other flotsam and jetsam

3. The ai is rather stupid, and can usually cross over and rape you in your trench with their machine gun in the time it takes you to reload

4. squad tactics would be pretty awesome, and would probably fix the entire problem. but the fact that they all go prone at the sight of an enemy makes them prone to rape themselves and you with friendly fire, they also tend to get stuck, which takes up valuable time wile you get them out, they can step on each other a lot too.

and bunker cover gets shot up, crushed, or otherwise destroyed in a short amount of time. sure, the scrap brain could solve this, but for me, its buggy, and it interferes with the keys for telekenisis. and useing a concrete sprayer isnt very practical because the walls you make are often defective, and they take up time in which you are likely to be killed, or the weapon shot to peices.

All in all, i want shorter reload times for most weapons OR short reload time for pistols and/or compact rifles.



what if there isnt a different car? what if that is the best it gets? then what should you do?