How can you be optimistic? Data says its not happening.

Because we aren't talking about Data doing this. We are talking about how it would be possible to hack in multiplayer, WITHOUT Data's help.

With those criteria, it's not.

:|

Throwing theories around ain't harming anything, just as long as they don't start thinking it'll happen because they suggested a way to do it.

Well I'm not talking just about your little "hack." Generally speaking, MP not going to happen.

Hey, hu guys? There's a simple way to have some sort of multiplayer.

First of all, CC can get text imput from the net, as shown by the chatroom scene.

So here's what I suggest:

Needed: 2 people, 1 copy of CC, a program that can send info to CC (Basically anything can do this, chatrooms, servers... as long as it can go online), 1 list of lua commands (written down or typed or whatever, it just needs to be able to be referenced quickly by player 2), 1 picture of the map being used (Also for quick referencing, it needs to show coordinates of locations on the map, though)

Step 1: Player 1 starts up Cortex command and loads up the Multiplayer map. Player 2 opens data sending program, and the Map and Lua commands referencing sheets.

Step 2: Player 2 inputs commands into data sending program.

Step 3: Player 1's CC reads and uses these commands.

Step 4: ??? (Preferably, Player 1's CC sends back info such as health of units and unit locations.)

Step 5: Multiplayer!


So only one player would have a visual representation, but it would be a form of multiplayer. Additionally, the datasending program could impliment the map and the data being sent back from player 1's CC to at least show where the units are visually, making it a bit easier for Player 2 to issue commands.

A crazy addition to previous idea: Make the multiplayer map... but have it check the IRC for commands. anyone in the IRC could send down units at the player, if they knew what commands to input.


If i'm horribly, horribly wrong, feel free to say so. If I'm not, get to work and astound Data for me, because I suck at modding anything.

ffs, Tim has shown that you can communicate between applications.

Whoopdiedoo.

Now he just has to show that you can control those applications remotely. Good luck with that, considering there is no in-game support for that.

Why would you need to control those applications remotely?

Wait, who are you talking to, Projekt? Because if you were talking to me, I think you misunderstood.

All my method is doing is sending data back and forth, with the applications deciding what to do with that data themselves.

Basically, we already have CC looking at the IRC chat. All someone has to do to get my method working would be to modify the IRC scene so that it puts messages from the IRC into the console, rather than displaying them at the top of the screen. Then anyone who entered IRC could mess with anyone playing the modified IRC scene just by typing in a Lua command (Well, you'd have to filter out their names so it accepted it as a Lua command rather than gibberish, but you get the idea)

THE ABOVE IS THE POINT I'M TRYING TO MAKE. THE BELOW IS AN EXPANSION THAT WOULD BE REDICULOUSLY DIFFICULT, BUT NOT IMPOSSIBLE, TO CREATE.

I see that my above post was not very well organized, so I'll try to clarify my idea here:

Create the modified IRC scene stated above, but have it look at some different server (Henceforth, the scene will eb referred to as the "Multiplayer scene"). This scene should also record and send data about actors' health and positions and send it to said server.

Next, Create a program (Yes, from scratch, It doesn't matter what programming language is used) that has an easy list of Lua commands (Perferably, it would only allow you the same commands the NPC has), and a visual representation of the map (Note: It would only show the map as it was when the game began, as making an updating map would be difficult if not impossible). This program should send commands to the server that the Multiplayer Map looks at, and receive data on locations and health of units from said server. It would then display said units and their health on the map representation (the units would probably just be represented by dots or something).

So one player would be playing like normal, except the other player is effectively controlling the NPCs. Bam, much better multiplayer.

EDIT: Just realised, there would have to be some sort of way to make the scene only be one person vs. another. Maybe the person with the custom program sends a username along with the commands, and the CC player just has to change a line of code somewhere in the Lua file so it only looks for data from that person? That might work.

Hell, the username bit could even be used in the IRC Multiplayer idea to only accept commands from one user.

@Dvd:to send the data back to the other exe.

things like this can and do happen, its basically a cross between direct reverse engineering and trickery. theyre usually only in the form of trainers (life hacks etc) though, so this is a lot more ambitious. if its possible to force the random variables to comply with one-another, and you send the data in a way that involves minimal lag (binary action status [there arent many actions anyway, eg 1100 for A and W pressed, and an angle for the weapon, as a value out of 1: 0.5 = 180 degrees], if shooting then the bullet spread data, the status data, maybe each half-minute send coordinates that resync actor positions; all of this would be 10kb maximum per packet (3-5 packets per second on dialup - only problem would be the effect of random numbers on fullauto weapons at that speed.) , send weapon data on change of weapon) then desyncing would be less of an issue, as most of the physics is fairly deterministic, though terrain desync could get bad with mods that cut too much.. but anyway, come on, a little bit of desync can be hilarious fun, in a WTF HAX? kind of way.
eg of a packet in simplest form:
i wouldnt like it in the master-slave kind of way though, it would be much better server based as originally set out. that way, essentially, the server is acting as the constant "master", but in more of a messenger way.
anyway, i think its plausible. it wouldnt be flawless, but it would be fun.

edit: btw, that packet above is 21 bytes.

Dude, the IRC scene already can send messages back to the IRC. Using Lua, CC can both send and receive data from places. Thus, my idea is possible.

You do realize that your idea was basically my idea but restated in such a way that it made very little sense, right?

Right, one more time, altogether now:

Main Server receives data from player 1's CC and sends it to player 2's CC
Player 2's CC receives data, and using Lua interprets the data in such a way as to utilize it
Main Server receives data from player 2's CC and sends it to player 1's CC
Player 1's CC receives data, and using Lua interprets the data in such a way as to utilize it

Rinse and repeat. This is done everytime there is a change, ie; movement\aiming\health change\physics calculation.

So for example, the data will be sent to the Main Server, will it will then be sent to the other console and intepreted:

data 1100 0.75 1 0.3 065 1

Lua looks at this and goes:

"Oh, data, that is the trigger. Now I am expecting 6 arguments:
Keys, aim, whether or not shooting, the random variable, the health of actor, and the current AI mode."

It then uses that data, looks at the clone in its game, and changes the health, the AI mode, makes it starts shooting, makes it move up and to the left, and aims it 270 degrees from north.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

...

And I just realized an alternative to all of this. It's fast, simple, and easy. Give me some time to test it.
Basically it involves hosting CC on a server, and a program to spoof CC into thinking that both players are using the same computer.

Solves all the problems with synch, lag, ect, as all the players need to do is stream the graphics. The rest is done on the server. Cloud computing ftw.

That's LAN play. It's nothing different from using remote desktop, except that if you had the server doing it, it might be less laggy.

Anyways, I don't know why you people are being so lame and arguing so much over this when you haven't actually tried doing any of it. You can't all just wait for me to make everything.

...I just realised, we uh, have online play. You know Tim's IRC scene? Check the Lua code. You can drop dropships on other people. Yeah.

So if someone could flesh that out some so you can order troops around (At least change their AI mode and where the dropships drop or something), then we have ourselves a nice bit of Multiplayer, Human vs. Human-acting-as-CPU style.

Maybe add mod support for DarkStorm troops and some of the other more popular factions.

I'd try it myself, but being more into C++, the dots everywhere confuse me. I get the logic, but it'd take me a bit to memorize the actual commands needed.

I believe that idea has been stated a couple times already.
But it does open up a slightly new idea. What if each player had no idea what the other player had in his game? To attack the other player's base you would order a dropship full of soldiers and take them down to a predefined location to teleport out, which would spawn them as enemies in the other player's game. The enemies on your screen would be ordered by the other player and "teleported" to your game. You would still have to pay for your attacking force and defending force, and if your brain was killed or you ran out of gold you could send out a lose/win event.
This would require no transfer of game logic, only the names of actors, devices, and the occasional ACrab.
And no, I'm not going to make it. I'm lazy and don't have a need for multiplayer.