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| [Possible Bug] Crab bomb http://45.55.195.193/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=11621 |
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| Author: | Andrew [ Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
While playing CC I noticed that filling the transport craft is limitless. However the weight of the transporter rises and it will be harder to navigate it. Eventually if you fill it up to some level it might actually be unable to lift from the ground or even crush. What I had been playing with was filling the craft with like 300 crabs + 30 grenades (let me refer to it later as "crab bomb") and then make it "drop" on the enemy bunker (training level is best for this purpose). At first I thought it would simply cause an extremely powerful explosion. And it undoubtedly had, but not only ... The side effect of this "crab bomb" was killing on instant any other units that were on board before explosion (or damaging them - robots in my deep bunker had once lost their legs). Eventually if you fill up the craft with sufficient amount of crabs you will be able to kill computer player without even moving. I suppose this is a very unwanted behaviour. For instance if "crab bomb" would be used in multiplayer game other players that spent all their gold on robots will simply lose. And as you can see that "crab bomb" itself is very cheap, you only need to pay for destroyed craft (80 gold) and eventually for grenades (but they are not needed). In my opinion there is only one 'proper' way to solve this problem. There should be limit for amount of stuff you can put to the craft (like defining each crafts capacity and products volume). It shouldn't be restricted to mass in general, because it still should be OK to cause some havoc with "bombs". However these shouldn't be that powerful and mustn't cause enemy units to die. While testing I found that up to 80 crabs is still ok (except for the sudden lag). Tell me your opinions on this matter. |
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| Author: | CandleJack [ Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
Then don't use crab bombs. Also, I'm pretty sure limited transport has been suggested before. |
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| Author: | Grif [ Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
Large numbers of physics objects interacting at once have a tendency to destroy unrelated actors and brains. The answer to this is to stop making giant piles of physics objects. As for limited craft; they ARE limited. You can't actually use a dropship with a million crabs in it; it's a useless bomb. If you don't want people cheating, DON'T CHEAT. There's no real way to prevent a few exploits of the game engine. |
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| Author: | Andrew [ Sun Jun 29, 2008 12:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
Well, using mods and stuff for fun is one thing, but this is actually available in normal gameplay (especially scenario). I personally wouldn't use such cheap trick against other players, but there is still possibility that someone will get carried away and make that kind of drop. It simply shouldn't be possible to achieve in standard gameplay. And I don't neglect that game engine should be flawless. I am aware that sometimes to achieve one goal you have to give up one some matters. My previous proposition wasn't really the way to solve the nature of the problem, but rather the positive workaround. It shouldn't involve much changes in game engine. |
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| Author: | duel90 [ Sun Jun 29, 2008 4:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
i shouldn't think that crabs will be so readily available in the real game scenarios, which i should think would be more class balanced and objective orientated. so that should rule out cheating by crab bombing altogether |
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| Author: | Lord Tim [ Sun Jun 29, 2008 6:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
In the actual game, you won't be able to buy free crabs. You'll have to obtain your crabs via more difficult processes. |
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| Author: | CantTouchTheGround [ Sun Jun 29, 2008 6:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
I got my crabs for free from Tim. Commence sexual innuendo! |
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| Author: | Roy-G-Biv [ Sun Jun 29, 2008 3:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
CantTouchTheGround wrote: I got my crabs for free from Tim. Commence sexual innuendo! Sounds perverted. I'd rather stay wild crab free. A gigantic actor amount will spontaniously kill other units, or your brain. I learned that from KMF hard. |
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| Author: | The Fat Sand Rat [ Sun Jun 29, 2008 6:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
Roy-G-Biv wrote: CantTouchTheGround wrote: I got my crabs for free from Tim. Commence sexual innuendo! Sounds perverted. *facepalm.jpg* ITT twelve-year-olds who do not know the definition of sexual innuendo. Bets that he claims he was being sarcastic? Anyway, this is, and I know of absolutely no other way to put this, like pointing out 'HEY GUYS THE PLATYPUS IS A STRANGE ANIMAL'. We get it. Topic has been brought up a thousand times. Many actors in a craft cause it to go down, they all spawn in close proximity, glitchy explosion-type event occurs. Can we please move on? |
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| Author: | Dal [ Sun Jun 29, 2008 11:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
It's an engine bug (particle velocities clipping through the map afaik); has nothing to do with dropships other than that's how you made it happen. |
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| Author: | jaybud4 [ Tue Jul 01, 2008 4:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
Dal wrote: It's an engine bug (particle velocities clipping through the map afaik); has nothing to do with dropships other than that's how you made it happen. |
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| Author: | Grif [ Tue Jul 01, 2008 2:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
Wasn't complete gibberish. Particle velocities clipping through the map, as far as I know; particles are going so fast they go through the map without displacing terrain, as far as I know. He's actually probably correct. As the engine handles too many physical objects it tends to break down, and, it seems, stop calculating the terrain displacement of some objects, which results in them shooting out apparently invisible rays of instant death. |
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| Author: | jaybud4 [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
Velocities = pl. of velocity Velocity = rapidity of motion or operation; swiftness; speed Last I heard, a number to indicate speed (of particles, in this case) could not clip through the map. All grammar nazi-ism aside, yeah, from what we know, he's right. |
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| Author: | Darlos9D [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 6:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
Grif wrote: Large numbers of physics objects interacting at once have a tendency to destroy unrelated actors and brains. The answer to this is to stop making giant piles of physics objects. As for limited craft; they ARE limited. You can't actually use a dropship with a million crabs in it; it's a useless bomb. If you don't want people cheating, DON'T CHEAT. There's no real way to prevent a few exploits of the game engine. Regardless of whether or not this is a topic that has been gone over in the past, I feel this is a terrible response, from a game design standpoint. Perhaps you and your buddy agreeing not to be dumb is fine for now, but in future iterations, this is a problem that needs to be fixed. And I feel that Andrew's solution effectively fixes the problem. I, too, have wondered why craft don't have some kind of capacity limitation. Setting up said limitation might not be too hard. Since the engine already has a way to automatically figure out how a given object will collide with other things based entirely off of its sprite, I figure its probably not much of a stretch to look at an object and see how many non-empty pixels it actually has. So, you take that surface area and use that as the objects "volume." Then, a craft would have a variable for how much it could hold total. |
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| Author: | Frejesal [ Tue Jul 08, 2008 12:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Possible Bug] Crab bomb |
DON'T change it, because it's FUN. Seriously, just punch your friend if he wants to cheat, or push him away from the keyboard while he's spending time loading crabs. Or if you're a total WIMP then ctrl+r |
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