All right, got the new head on and tweaked the feathers so they don't get shot. It's now possible to headshot the Crow, though there may still be some trouble if you aim for the bottom half of his head.

Also, I made the slug thrower and shotgun. The shotgun seems more powerful to me at least, but the slug thrower can still shred a vanilla actor at close range. I'll work on the other two weapons: I can't get the spear to stick in people, but I could make it so that throwing it alone is lethal, like the Ronin stone.

EDIT: I toned down the shotgun so it fires less particles and slowed down its firing rate. I also made the javelin and carbine rifle. It seems that grenades are, by default, held with their sprites pointing 45 degrees below the horizontal. For those of you who saw only math gibberish, that spear ain't held right. Is there any way to rotate images in MSPaint in increments other than 90 degrees? Also, it often rips off the user's off arm when thrown. No idea why that is.

Moving on, the carbine certainly has a range advantage over everything else, but its damage is pretty wimpy. I usually test the weapons by seeing how long it takes to use them to kill everything in the tutorial mission, and those dummies took a long time to down even with headshots. I think damage would increase with fleshy targets, but I'll leave it for you guys to assess.

I'd like some feedback. I can invisibly increase the carbine's damage if you feel it's too wimpy, and if you think the slug thrower would feel better with a longer reload time I'd advise a larger clip to make up for it. Feel free to say if you want any other tweaks: Weapons are easy to fiddle with. Also, I'll see about tweaking the Crow's wounds: As is he can't take much punishment at all.

EDIT: Removed attachment, see latest entry.

No way to turn it anything less than 90 degrees in paint, you need to either use photoshop or re-sprite it. Sorry.

Ok, feedback: Weapons need tweaking and some nice effects.

the crow's body needs more shading, the legs are a bit thin, and he's over all a bit top-heavy. Shoulders and up is great though. Good work.

The sprites are Allen's don't congratulate me.

You say my weapons need adjustment, but not what I should change. I know I can steal the smoke effects from the vanilla weapons, but how should I change their performance? Or did you just mean that I should do everything I suggested in my original post?

I can't test it, unless you put all the sounds in the mod's directory. they're all under new names because i use the mac version and it's a little further ahead than b22 on windows. I really, really want to test it though. I'm thinking of doing some bunker modules and spriting up an alternate version of the actor, or another soldier class.

Oh, by weapons need tweaking I mean 'they're good, but they need to be played with and prettier'. I don't know what they need yet, they are fine for now. I just meant they're clearly not finished. I'm focusing more on the actor anyway. I'd do the legs myself, but multiple frames don't agree with me. I might work on the body and/or some attachables later.

Okay, thanks to Comment i got a working version and i'll say that the weapons are great for a first run-thru.

Things I'd tweak if i could:

Shotgun: I don't remember if the auto shotgun in normal B22 worked this way, but the way it behaves in the mac build is as close of an example. The shot slows and disappears, but has a tight choke. It behaves like a grenade launcher in a way, each round slowing down and falling gradually, then disappearing. If there's a way to make the cone of death that comes out begin a little before the end of the muzzle that would look really cool.

Carbine: Slower firing rate and heavier bullets. I want it somewhere between a semi-auto rifle and a sniper rifle if that makes sense. It should smack the living f*ck out of whatever it hits - knock them to the ground - but have a long reload and a lower ROF.

Slug thrower: It penetrates the terrain a little too much, if there's a way to keep it from doing that but to still keep the rounds heavy enough to knock a Heavy Crobo around, it should be done. imagine each round as a very slow, blunt sub-sonic .50 caliber round. If there's a way to give it more ammo and a super-high rate of fire that would be great. The shake-range is perfect already.

Javelin: You've already covered what's wrong with it already, but the main thing I'm worried about is its ability to fly like a real javelin. Is this possible? It doesn't have to stick, it could just explode on impact

I may dream up an alternate version that has the same high-mass shell, but that shoots slower, has a lower capacity and a tighter shake-range. I'm not sure though.

I think something has been missed here. With the larger scale comes a heavier importance on each unit, so i imagined them being able to take a lot of punishment. In turn, the weapons should do enough harm to take one another out in half a clip or less, from each weapon. This is going to be unbalanced with all vanilla content and most mods. They were never meant to work in conjunction with one another. It's only being tested against them because we have so little to test.

If any of this doesn't make sense, is impossible or is problematic for any other reason, let me know.

The spear should fly perfectly in game, Data seems to have nailed MOSRotating physics.

the only place where I can see a problem is the Slug Thrower. For a heavy particle to not shred terrain, it needs to have virtually no sharpness (like, 1) and not much fire velocity. Unfortunately, this means it isn't too effective on actual soldiers.
It can be tweaked, but just take it into account that there may be little we can do about it, without reverting to unusual TDExplosive tricks. We should be OK though, we'll see.

sorry, that was all over the place.
what I meant was the slugthrower can be tweaked to hurt terrain less, but possibly at the expense of actual damage.

surely the slug thrower will work simmilarly to the revolver cannon?

I was under the impression that the slug thrower should just shoot really blunt bullets that weigh more than usual. The revolver cannon is more about smashing things with sheer mass. It's like a normal SMG is a sword while the slug thrower is a club or something. Extending this analogy would mean the revolver cannon's a battering ram.

I'll take another look at the vanilla stuff to tweak the values, or look up your reference points in Wikipedia. In CC, mass is in kilograms and speed is in metres per second, right? The shotgun trick sounds like air resistance is used, which should be simple enough to pull off. And don't fret about bigger clip sizes and faster firing: Those are literally two of the easiest things to change in a gun.

I'll see about changing the Crow's wounds for my next iteration. He'll be able to take a lot more punishment.

I know, double post. This thread doesn't move very quickly, though, and I want people to be aware when a new version of the mod is out.

Without further ado, the weapons are better, doing pretty much everything Allen lists. The knockback on the slug thrower and carbine rifle make them very fun to pin actors with, and the shotgun's effective range is now limited. Still didn't fix the javelin.

Also, the Crow can now take a hit. Hurrah. I tried using the Coalition Heavy Sniper trick to get smoke when the weapons fire, but the nature of the trick led to the Crow shooting his own legs off. I'll try another method, but whether it'll work or not depends on if a certain bug has been fixed yet.

EDIT: New version.

I suggest you post that to the OP.

Considering he didn't start the thread and it's an early and quickly obsolete beta, I think that's a bad idea.

Well said. Meanwhile i've got the "mini-sledge" (the lower ROF/capacity, higher accuracy SMG) sprited, along with new arm and leg sprites that aren't as sucky and will probably look better in game, plus an adjusted helmet has a little more of that Joker-esque insanity that i feel is appropriate.

I made 5 frames of arms even though you guys said you didn't want to mess with multiple frames. Just choose the three that look the best in sequence, i used some math and the straight-line thing to make them. Also, a new hand (lower right) and foot (under legs) that don't look like ass.



I added the long rifle, along with a really unfinished tomahawk. The little feather-bundles to the right of the weapons are things i thought could be pinned to the ends of the weapons (for aesthetic purposes only). If this is possible or makes sense, then it would be cool to see. Not a priority at all though.



I haven't had a chance to test the latest "build", but i will either tonight or tomorrow.

BIg Considerations
I feel like the head should be bigger and easier to hit. While i'm not all that into keeping with the CC art style, i think the proportions of the characters should be at least similar. That's something i don't want to change a whole bunch, it works so well in-game already.


EDIT: also, as for putting the early builds of the mod on the front page, i will once this is moved to "Mod Releases" (a day that is far from here, i think). I'll do that/have that done once we've got actors/weapons from each of the three tribes, at least one scene and three separate activities, one for each tribe. I don't want to advertise this before it's in that condition.

I've been thinking about scenes and i've got a few ideas sketched out. Those will probably be the next drawings posted. I want to get someone Lua-fluent on board and maybe make a mission or something.

So: Calling all Lua Masters; your time is nigh.

Attaching your doo-dads to the weapons is a simple and painless task, so it can be done.

Inflated the head, changed the hands and feet. I'm unsure about the placement of the feather on the new helmet: I realize that these guys are supposed to be psychotic cavemen and an iffy fashion sense comes with that, but the feather just sticking out of the top looks more like an anime cowlick than an emblem of a brutal warrior.

Made the mini sledge and long rifle. As is, the long rifle is just a carbine with a smaller clip and more damaging bullets. What kind of stuff should I do to make them different? I know that you want knockback on the bullets, but maybe we could make one of them have lower mass and more sharpness for emphasis on penetrating power instead of shoving the target back?

Lastly, I must've been unclear on how you sprite limbs. Take a look at these leg frames from the Kloveska Oppressor:

The hip's at the left, the ankle's at the right, and in any frame you can draw a perfectly horizontal line between the two. Your sprites just have the further part of the limb rotate around the middle joint. Keep drawing your legs top-down if that's more comfortable, I can rotate them to the right orientation. However, I don't have any programs that can rotate by the smaller increments that would make the sprites fit this rule.

That's it out of me. I look forward to whatever stuff comes next: This is a fun project to work on.

EDIT: New version.